Лист до міжн. організацій щодо "Континенту" (англ). РЕДАГУЙТЕ.
03/05/2004 | S@nya
Ідея написати листа до міжнародних організацій-партнерів Укрчастотнадзору з*явилася в цій гілці: http://maidan.org.ua/n/free/1078504198
Підредагуйте, якщо є помилки. Також слід ще визначитись, чи варто послати одного листа, назбиравши під ним енну кількість підписів, чи кожен, хто хоче, відсилатиме листа за цим макетом.
Адреси, на які планується відправити листа тут: http://maidan.org.ua/n/free/1078505065
А ось і сам лист:
Dear Sirs,
We would like to inform you, that your ukrainian partner, “The Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications”, is involved in brutal, illegal actions against free mass-media in Ukraine.
On the 3 of March 2004 the members of this organization took part in the shutdown of Radio “Kontynent”. This was the only radio station retranslating Radio Liberty/Radio Free Europe (RL/RFE), VOA, and other international broadcasters.
“The Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications” is not authorized to take such actions, furthermore, the question of canceling the license of Radio “Kontynent” is being studied by European Court, and thus any actions against this Mass-Media are illegal until the decision of European Court is announced. The only reason for shutting down the radio “Kontynent” is its free and independent information policy, conflicting with the President’s Kuchma campaign against independent media.
This illegal action of your partner is sharply condemned by European Union structures and U.S. Department of State, and also by Ukrainian community inside the country and abroad.
We hope this information can be useful for you and you will reconsider your attitude to this partnership.
Best regards,
Підредагуйте, якщо є помилки. Також слід ще визначитись, чи варто послати одного листа, назбиравши під ним енну кількість підписів, чи кожен, хто хоче, відсилатиме листа за цим макетом.
Адреси, на які планується відправити листа тут: http://maidan.org.ua/n/free/1078505065
А ось і сам лист:
Dear Sirs,
We would like to inform you, that your ukrainian partner, “The Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications”, is involved in brutal, illegal actions against free mass-media in Ukraine.
On the 3 of March 2004 the members of this organization took part in the shutdown of Radio “Kontynent”. This was the only radio station retranslating Radio Liberty/Radio Free Europe (RL/RFE), VOA, and other international broadcasters.
“The Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications” is not authorized to take such actions, furthermore, the question of canceling the license of Radio “Kontynent” is being studied by European Court, and thus any actions against this Mass-Media are illegal until the decision of European Court is announced. The only reason for shutting down the radio “Kontynent” is its free and independent information policy, conflicting with the President’s Kuchma campaign against independent media.
This illegal action of your partner is sharply condemned by European Union structures and U.S. Department of State, and also by Ukrainian community inside the country and abroad.
We hope this information can be useful for you and you will reconsider your attitude to this partnership.
Best regards,
Відповіді
2004.03.05 | YZ
Re: Лист до міжн. організацій щодо "Континенту" (англ). РЕДАГУЙТЕ.
> We would like to inform you, that your ukrainian partner, “The Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications”/USCRFST/, is involved in brutal, illegal actions/pointed/
against free mass-media in Ukraine.
> /As/ On March, the 3rd, 2004 /USCRFST/ broke all the laws and shutdown "Radio “Kontynent”".
/The later/ (This) was the only radio station retranslating Radio Liberty/Radio Free Europe (RL/RFE), VOA, and other international broadcasters /in Ukraine/.
> /As a matter of fact, USCRFST/ is not authorized to take such an action, furthermore, the question of canceling the license of Radio “Kontynent” is being studied by /The - в ім"я не входить?/ European Court, /thus making/ any actions against this Mass-Media illegal until the decision of European Court is announced. The only reason for shutting down the radio “Kontynent” /was/ its free and independent /broadcasting/ policy, /which conflicted/ with the President’s Kuchma campaign against independent media.
> This illegal action of your partner is sharply condemned by European Union structures/institutions - якими?/ and U.S. Department of State, and also by Ukrainian community inside the country and abroad. Може, алл араунд зе ворлд?
> We hope this information can be useful for you and you will reconsider your attitude to this partnership.
Шось я тут не зрозумів. Це що, типу... ?? До чого зазиваєте? Нє пісять в "єго" горшок (щиро вибачаюся), чи ... до чого? Змінити мнєніє? Чи ...
Ніби ж, можна і кондемнити.
А, може так прийнято. Не знаю. Треба глянути як там в дипломаичних колах до чогось зазивають в таких випадках.
>
> Best regards,
2004.03.06 | SeaL
Re: Лист до міжн. організацій щодо "Континенту" (англ). РЕДАГУЙТЕ.
YZ пише:> > This illegal action of your partner is sharply condemned by European Union structures/institutions - якими?/ and U.S. Department of State, and also by Ukrainian community inside the country and abroad. Може, алл араунд зе ворлд?
>
> Шось я тут не зрозумів. Це що, типу... ?? До чого зазиваєте? Нє пісять в "єго" горшок (щиро вибачаюся), чи ... до чого? Змінити мнєніє? Чи ...
> Ніби ж, можна і кондемнити.
> А, може так прийнято. Не знаю. Треба глянути як там в дипломаичних колах до чогось зазивають в таких випадках.
"Condemn" does sound kinda harsh;)... it is rather unusual for those guys to actually "condemn" something - they are not writing a letter to Pravda after all... what they usually do is "express their concern" or "urge" somebody to do something.
Cheers:)
2004.03.06 | YZ
Re: Лист до міжн. організацій щодо "Континенту" (англ). РЕДАГУЙТЕ.
Та чому ж?Он, Проді здуру закондемнив СВ із подачі Рабіновича&Co , який(&Co) навіть не зареєстрований належним чином.
Так що ці слова "кондемнити" "Кучму" - ніяких неспівбіжностей. Доповнюють одне одне на всі 100%. Як в "Правді".
2004.03.06 | casesensitive
Re: Лист до міжн. організацій щодо "Континенту" (англ). РЕДАГУЙТЕ.
corrections: //> Dear Sirs,
>
> We would like to inform you/, remove/ that your ukrainian partner, “The Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications”, is involved in brutal, illegal actions against free mass-media in Ukraine.
> On the 3/d/ of March 2004 the members of this organization took part in the shutdown of Radio “Kontynent”. This was the only radio station retranslating Radio Liberty/Radio Free Europe (RL/RFE), VOA, and other international broadcasters.
> “The Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications” is not authorized to take such actions /without the court decision/, furthermore, the question of cancel/l/ing the license of Radio “Kontynent” is being studied by /the/ European Court, and thus any actions against this /lower case Mass-Media/ are illegal until the decision of European Court is announced. The only reason for shutting down the radio “Kontynent” /was due to/ its free and independent information policy, conflicting with the President’s Kuchma campaign against independent media.
> This illegal action of your partner is sharply condemned by European Union structures and U.S. Department of State /add Internationl Journalists Association or what's it called?/, and also by Ukrainian community inside the country and abroad.
> We hope this information can be useful for you and you will reconsider your attitude /towards?/ this partnership.
>
> Best regards,
2004.03.06 | SeaL
Re: Лист до міжн. організацій щодо "Континенту" (англ). РЕДАГУЙТЕ.
> Dear Sirs,>
> We would like to inform you, that your ukrainian partner, “The Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications”, is involved in brutal, illegal actions against free mass-media in Ukraine.
In "ukrainian partner", "Ukrainian" needs to be capitalized. You do not realy need the hyphen in "mass-media"; consider removing the hyphen.
> On the 3 of March 2004 the members of this organization took part in the shutdown of Radio “Kontynent”. This was the only radio station retranslating Radio Liberty/Radio Free Europe (RL/RFE), VOA, and other international broadcasters.
There is no need for the inverted commas for Kontynent. Also, consider "rebroadcasting" instead of "retranslating".
> “The Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications” is not authorized to take such actions, furthermore, the question of canceling the license of Radio “Kontynent” is being studied by European Court, and thus any actions against this Mass-Media are illegal until the decision of European Court is announced.
Decapitalize Mass-Media, as already noted; In "...the question of canceling the license of Radio “Kontynent” is being studied by European Court", I would rather use "issue" instead of "question"; if there is formal legal action in process (claims filed etc.), you may want to use "is currently under consideration" instead of "is being studied".
The only reason for shutting down the radio “Kontynent” is its free and independent information policy, conflicting with the President’s Kuchma campaign against independent media.
Remove the "the" before "President".
> This illegal action of your partner is sharply condemned by European Union structures and U.S. Department of State, and also by Ukrainian community inside the country and abroad.
It is "_the_ U.S. Department of State". Consider using "organizations", "agencies" or "institutions" instead of "structures". Use "the" before "Ukrainian community". If you are writing to an American group, avoid using "abroad", because many people will not know what it means; use "inside and outside of Ukraine" instead.
> We hope this information can be useful for you and you will reconsider your attitude to this partnership.
>
> Best regards,
Unless you have met these people, it would be proper to use "Yours faithfully/Yours truly", "Sincerely", "Respectfully" etc. instead of "Best regards".
2004.03.06 | SeaL
Re: Лист до міжн. організацій щодо "Континенту" (англ). РЕДАГУЙТЕ.
A few more minor things:>
> The only reason for shutting down the radio “Kontynent” is its free and independent information policy, conflicting with the President’s Kuchma campaign against independent media.
>
The posessive case should be "President Kuchma's", not "President's Kuchma".
> > We hope this information can be useful for you and you will reconsider your attitude to this partnership.
On a more substantive note: the sentence above sounds rather blatant;)... are you sure you want to tell these people what they need to do? Consider approaching this more gently.
2004.03.06 | S@nya
VERSION 1.2. Дякую за поправки. What else should be changed?
Dear Sirs,We would like to inform you, that your Ukrainian partner, “The Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications”/USCRFST/, is involved in brutal, illegal actions against free mass-media in Ukraine.
On March, the 3rd, 2004 USCRFST broke all the laws and shutdown Radio Kontynent. This was the only radio station rebroadcasting Radio Liberty/Radio Free Europe (RL/RFE), VOA, and other international broadcasters.
USCRFST is not authorized to take such actions, furthermore, the issue of canceling the license of Radio Kontynent is currently under consideration in the European Court, and thus any actions against this mass-media are illegal until the decision of European Court is announced. The only reason for shutting down the Radio Kontynent is its free and independent broadcasting policy, conflicting with President Kuchma’s campaign against independent media.
This illegal action of your partner is sharply condemned by the European Commission, Reporters Without Borders and the U.S. Department of State, and also by the Ukrainian community inside and outside of Ukraine.
We hope this information can be useful for you in your further contacts with USCRFST.
Respectfully,
2004.03.06 | SeaL
Re: VERSION 1.2. Дякую за поправки. What else should be changed?
S@nya пише:> Dear Sirs,
>
> We would like to inform you, that your Ukrainian partner, “The Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications”/USCRFST/, is involved in brutal, illegal actions against free mass-media in Ukraine.
Again, no inverted commas are needed for _the Ukrainian State Centre..., and the "the" does not need to be capitalized.
> On March, the 3rd, 2004 USCRFST broke all the laws and shutdown Radio Kontynent. This was the only radio station rebroadcasting Radio Liberty/Radio Free Europe (RL/RFE), VOA, and other international broadcasters.
"shut down" in a verbal phrase is spelled as two separate words; "shutdown" as a noun - as one; consider adding "the programs of" before "Radio Liberty... etc."
> USCRFST is not authorized to take such actions, furthermore, the issue of canceling the license of Radio Kontynent is currently under consideration in the European Court, and thus any actions against this mass-media
the singular is "mass medium"; the plural is "mass media"
> are illegal until the decision of European Court is announced. The only reason for shutting down the
remove the "the"
> Radio Kontynent is its free and independent broadcasting policy, conflicting with President Kuchma’s campaign against independent media.
> This illegal action of your partner is sharply condemned by the European Commission, Reporters Without Borders and the U.S. Department of State, and also by the Ukrainian community inside and outside of Ukraine.
Do all intended recipients of the letter know what Reporters Without Borders is? Does it need to be explained?
> We hope this information can be useful for you in your further contacts with USCRFST.
>
> Respectfully,
2004.03.06 | 123
Re: VERSION 1.2. Дякую за поправки. What else should be changed?
SeaL пише:> S@nya пише:
> > Dear Sirs,
> >
> > We would like to inform you, that your Ukrainian partner, “The Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications”/USCRFST/, is involved in brutal, illegal actions against free mass-media in Ukraine.
>
> Again, no inverted commas are needed for _the Ukrainian State Centre..., and the "the" does not need to be capitalized.
IMHO, "the" should be capitalized.
> > On March, the 3rd, 2004 USCRFST broke all the laws and shutdown Radio Kontynent. This was the only radio station rebroadcasting Radio Liberty/Radio Free Europe (RL/RFE), VOA, and other international broadcasters.
>
> "shut down" in a verbal phrase is spelled as two separate words; "shutdown" as a noun - as one; consider adding "the programs of" before "Radio Liberty... etc."
Agree.
> > USCRFST is not authorized to take such actions, furthermore, the issue of canceling the license of Radio Kontynent is currently under consideration in the European Court, and thus any actions against this mass-media
>
> the singular is "mass medium"; the plural is "mass media"
>
> > are illegal until the decision of European Court is announced. The only reason for shutting down the
>
> remove the "the"
And insert "a" instead
> > Radio Kontynent is its free and independent broadcasting policy, conflicting with President Kuchma’s campaign against independent media.
> > This illegal action of your partner is sharply condemned by the European Commission, Reporters Without Borders and the U.S. Department of State, and also by the Ukrainian community inside and outside of Ukraine.
>
> Do all intended recipients of the letter know what Reporters Without Borders is? Does it need to be explained?
I would suggest to add links to the declarations by these institutions.
І я ще не дуже зрозумів - кому пишемо цого листа? Що це за "партнери"? Мабуть, я щось пропустив...
2004.03.06 | S@nya
Re: Кому посилаємо листа
Ідея написати листа до міжнародних організацій-партнерів Укрчастотнадзору з*явилася в цій гілці: http://maidan.org.ua/n/free/1078504198Адреси, на які планується відправити листа тут: http://maidan.org.ua/n/free/1078505065
2004.03.06 | S@nya
Re: VERSION 1.2. Дякую за поправки. What else should be changed?
>> Do all intended recipients of the letter know what Reporters Without Borders is? Does it need to be explained?
>
Yes, all recipients have to know what RWB is.
Thank you for your help.
Maybe you can also find some punctuation problems in the text?
2004.03.06 | S@nya
VERSION 1.3. Thanks, Seal!
Dear Sirs,We would like to inform you, that your Ukrainian partner, the Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications /USCRFST/, is involved in brutal, illegal actions against free mass-media in Ukraine.
On March, the 3rd, 2004 USCRFST broke all the laws and shut down Radio Kontynent. This was the only radio station rebroadcasting the programs of Radio Liberty/Radio Free Europe (RL/RFE), VOA, and other international broadcasters.
USCRFST is not authorized to take such actions, furthermore, the issue of canceling the license of Radio Kontynent is currently under consideration in the European Court, and thus any actions against this mass-medium are illegal until the decision of European Court is announced. The only reason for shutting down Radio Kontynent is its free and independent broadcasting policy, conflicting with President Kuchma’s campaign against independent media.
This illegal action of your partner is sharply condemned by the European Commission, Reporters Without Borders and the U.S. Department of State, and also by the Ukrainian community inside and outside of Ukraine.
We hope this information can be useful for you in your further contacts with USCRFST.
Respectfully,
2004.03.06 | Микита Чубинський
Ще виправлення
S@nya пише:> Dear Sirs,
>
> We would like to inform you,
тут не треба коми
> that your Ukrainian partner, the Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications /USCRFST/, is involved in brutal, illegal actions against free mass-media in Ukraine.
> On March, the 3rd, 2004
On March 3, 2004,
> USCRFST broke all the laws
Краще "broke the law"
> and shut down Radio Kontynent. This was the only radio station rebroadcasting the programs of Radio Liberty/Radio Free Europe (RL/RFE), VOA, and other international broadcasters.
> USCRFST is not authorized to take such actions, furthermore, the issue of canceling the license
IMHO, краще "cancellation of the license"
> of Radio Kontynent is currently under consideration in the European Court,
Офіційно він називається the European Court of Human Rights.
> and thus any actions against this mass-medium
термін "mass medium" не вживається щодо конкретних ЗМІ. Правильніше "this media outlet".
> are illegal until the decision of European Court
the European Court
> is announced. The only reason for shutting down Radio Kontynent is its free and independent broadcasting policy,
IMHO, коми не треба
> conflicting with President Kuchma’s campaign against independent media.
> This illegal action of your partner is sharply condemned
Краще "strongly condemned"
> by the European Commission, Reporters Without Borders and the U.S. Department of State, and also by the Ukrainian community inside and outside of Ukraine.
"of" не треба
> We hope this information can be useful for you in your further contacts with USCRFST.
Краще "We hope this information is useful"
>
> Respectfully,
2004.03.06 | SeaL
Re: Ще виправлення
Микита Чубинський пише:> S@nya пише:
> > Dear Sirs,
> >
> > We would like to inform you,
>
> тут не треба коми
Right-o:)
>
> > that your Ukrainian partner, the Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications /USCRFST/, is involved in brutal, illegal actions against free mass-media in Ukraine.
> > On March, the 3rd, 2004
>
> On March 3, 2004,
Yep
>
> > USCRFST broke all the laws
>
> Краще "broke the law"
Or, probably, "...acting in violation of Ukrainian law, shut down..."
>
> > and shut down Radio Kontynent. This was the only radio station rebroadcasting the programs of Radio Liberty/Radio Free Europe (RL/RFE), VOA, and other international broadcasters.
> > USCRFST is not authorized to take such actions, furthermore, the issue of canceling the license
>
> IMHO, краще "cancellation of the license"
could be either way, imho
>
> > of Radio Kontynent is currently under consideration in the European Court,
>
> Офіційно він називається the European Court of Human Rights.
>
> > and thus any actions against this mass-medium
>
> термін "mass medium" не вживається щодо конкретних ЗМІ. Правильніше "this media outlet".
That is very correct; "media outlet" is the term used in the business
>
> > are illegal until the decision of European Court
>
> the European Court
>
> > is announced. The only reason for shutting down Radio Kontynent is its free and independent broadcasting policy,
>
> IMHO, коми не треба
>
> > conflicting with President Kuchma’s campaign against independent media.
> > This illegal action of your partner is sharply condemned
>
> Краще "strongly condemned"
that is a matter of usage frequency; "strongly condemned" is definitely used more often, but "sharply" is still OK, imho
>
> > by the European Commission, Reporters Without Borders and the U.S. Department of State, and also by the Ukrainian community inside and outside of Ukraine.
>
> "of" не треба
Yeah, could do without that... whatever:)
2004.03.06 | SeaL
Re: VERSION 1.3. Thanks, Seal!
S@nya пише:> Dear Sirs,
>
> We would like to inform you, that your Ukrainian partner, the Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications /USCRFST/, is involved in brutal, illegal
consider "brutal AND illegal"
>actions against free mass-media in Ukraine.
> On March, the 3rd, 2004 USCRFST broke all the laws and shut down Radio Kontynent. This was the only radio station rebroadcasting the programs of Radio Liberty/Radio Free Europe (RL/RFE), VOA, and other international broadcasters.
> USCRFST is not authorized to take such actions,
consider using a semicolon (;) instead of comma before "furthermore"
>furthermore, the issue of canceling the license of Radio Kontynent is currently under consideration in the European Court, and thus any actions against this mass-medium are illegal until the decision of European Court is announced. The only reason for shutting down Radio Kontynent is its free and independent broadcasting policy, conflicting with President Kuchma’s campaign against independent media.
Not to get into finer points of the legal profession, but you may want to use "verdict" instead of "decision" when talking about a court pronouncement; I am not familiar enough with that particular court's procedure to be sure it is correct in this case though.
> This illegal action of your partner is sharply condemned by the European Commission, Reporters Without Borders and the U.S. Department of State, and also by the Ukrainian community inside and outside of Ukraine.
> We hope this information can be useful for you in your further contacts with USCRFST.
I actually like the last paragraph... sounds noncomitting, but ominous enough:)
>
> Respectfully,
S@nya, the rest of this looks good to me, but pls see comments further down the tree.
Cheers:)
2004.03.06 | S@nya
VERSION 1.4.
Dear Sirs and Madams,We would like to inform you that your Ukrainian partner, the Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications /USCRFST/, is involved in brutal and illegal actions against free mass-media in Ukraine.
On March 3, 2004, USCRFST broke the law and shut down Radio Kontynent. This was the only radio station rebroadcasting the programs of Radio Liberty/Radio Free Europe (RL/RFE), VOA, and other international broadcasters.
USCRFST is not authorized to take such actions; furthermore, the issue of canceling the license of Radio Kontynent is currently under consideration in the European Court of Human Rights, and thus any actions against this media outlet are illegal until the decision of European Court is announced. The only reason for shutting down Radio Kontynent is its free and independent broadcasting policy conflicting with President Kuchma’s campaign against independent media.
This illegal action of your partner is sharply condemned by the European Commission, Reporters Without Borders and the U.S. Department of State, and also by the Ukrainian community inside and outside of Ukraine.
We hope this information can be useful for you in your further contacts with USCRFST.
Respectfully,
2004.03.07 | S.
Re: VERSION 1.4.
Dear Sirs and Madams,S@nya пише:
> Dear Sirs,
Dear Sirs and Madams,
Cheers,
S.
2004.03.07 | S@nya
Re: VERSION 1.4.
Угу, згода. Виправлено.S. пише:
> Dear Sirs and Madams,
>
>
>
> S@nya пише:
> > Dear Sirs,
>
>
> Dear Sirs and Madams,
>
> Cheers,
> S.
2004.03.07 | YZ
Шолох вже сам все зробив.
http://www2.pravda.com.ua/archive/2004/march/6/news/5.shtml2004.03.07 | S@nya
Чому ж? Це не те, що робимо ми.
Чому ж? Це не те, що робимо ми. Ми хочемо вдарити по репутації Укрчастотнагляду, написавши його партнерам.Це зовсім не Міжн. асоціація журналістів, і не "РБК".
Чи ви вважаєте, що вже особливого сенсу в тому нема?..
2004.03.07 | Михайло Свистович
Re: Звичайно, не те.
S@nya пише:> Чому ж? Це не те, що робимо ми. Ми хочемо вдарити по репутації Укрчастотнагляду, написавши його партнерам.
Угу.
> Це зовсім не Міжн. асоціація журналістів, і не "РБК".
Угу
> Чи ви вважаєте, що вже особливого сенсу в тому нема?..
Звичайно, що є. Бити треба з усіх боків.
2004.03.07 | YZ
Та я про те, шо вже всі знають.А знають,як виглядає, вже всі (-)
2004.03.08 | S@nya
Re: Що далі?
Від чиєго імені відправляти?2004.03.08 | casesensitive
Re: Що далі?
Вот Вересень в УП жаловался, что, мол народ промолчит и послы и всяческие дипломаты никак не будут реагировать. Так может такое письмо стоит подписывать своими именами и рассылать по посольствам и редакциям "Свободы" и "Голоса" (как пострадавших станций)? Тогда они смогут представить подписи нескольких сотен украинцев как доказательство реакции общественности?2004.03.08 | S@nya
Re:Тоді може варто зробити збір підписів під листом?
casesensitive пише:> Вот Вересень в УП жаловался, что, мол народ промолчит и послы и всяческие дипломаты никак не будут реагировать. Так может такое письмо стоит подписывать своими именами и рассылать по посольствам и редакциям "Свободы" и "Голоса" (как пострадавших станций)? Тогда они смогут представить подписи нескольких сотен украинцев как доказательство реакции общественности?
Тоді може варто зробити збір підписів під листом? А то редакціям ми лише додамо клопотів, якшо кожен буде сам їм слати листа.
До того ж буде краше, якшо до міжнародних організацій лист прийде від лйдей-слухачів, а не з редакції "Свободи", наприклад.
До "Континеннту", Свободи і т.п. можна буде відправита копії, а також до "УКРЧАСТОТ НАГЛЯДУ"
2004.03.08 | casesensitive
Re:Тоді може варто зробити збір підписів під листом?
email все стерпит, а редакции смогут на пресс-конференциях предъявлять пачки писем от возмущенных слушателей2004.03.08 | casesensitive
еще идея
сделать укр/рус вариант письма -- в редакции "Свободы" поймут, и тогда проше найти желающих подписать.2004.03.08 | xabap
Re: Що далі?
На мою думку відправляти від імені всіх слухачів (в Україні і поза її межами) незалежних від режиму медії-про це написано в листі мойого знайомого.А ще думаю обов,язково належить повідомити:HUMAN RIGHTS COUNCIL(COMISSION)?при Раді Європи.2004.03.08 | S@nya
Re: Що далі?
xabap пише:> На мою думку відправляти від імені всіх слухачів (в Україні і поза її межами) незалежних від режиму медії-про це написано в листі мойого знайомого.А ще думаю обов,язково належить повідомити:HUMAN RIGHTS COUNCIL(COMISSION)?при Раді Європи.
Вибачте, шо не використав листа Вашого знайомого, але акція йде "з народу", а лист той дуже вже офіційний.
Як відправляти від всіх слухачів? Я ж не можу відправити зі свого майла і підписати "від всіх слухачів"... Мабуть потрібен хоч десяток підписів?
2004.03.09 | DevRand
о, слухайте - в мене ідея:
давайте окремою гілкою оголосимо збір підписів (до сьогодні до вечора, до 20-00 наприклад)і відправимо, по всім запланованим іноземним установам (до речі, якщо відправляти у посольства, то потрібні адреси. хто візьметься скласти список?). Так само завтра, післязавтра і скажімо до кінця тижня - будемо відправляти листи з тими, хто підписався у поточний день.
Отже, що нам зараз потрібно (це на сьогодні, і стосовно саме цього листа у міжнародні інституції):
1. текст англійською (є)
2. текст українською
3. список е-мейлів всіх установ, куди ми будемо його надсилати
4. нова гілка на форумі, щоб в ній люди могли підписуватися під листом.
2004.03.09 | Mykyta
Re: о, слухайте - в мене ідея:
DevRand пише:> давайте окремою гілкою оголосимо збір підписів (до сьогодні до вечора, до 20-00 наприклад)
> і відправимо, по всім запланованим іноземним установам (до речі, якщо відправляти у посольства, то потрібні адреси. хто візьметься скласти список?).
Якщо вже щось таке робити, то треба продумати збір підписів. Бо то не штука прислати сотню прізвищ - таке кожен за пів-години склепати може. Треба ще якусь контактну адресу додавати, щоб можна було вибірково перевірити, чи існують люди з того списку. Принаймі електронну пошту (хоча це не зовсім те, але краще, ніж нічого).
2004.03.09 | DevRand
треба попередити що якщо людина погоджується
і пидписує листа (з вказанням свого е-мейлу) то їх е-мейли будуть включені у текст листа
2004.03.09 | S@nya
Чудово. Давайте так і зробимо.
Чудово. Давайте так і зробимо. Текст англійською і російською (серед організацій-партнерів є російська) вже є, зараз зроблю окрему гілку для підписів.2004.03.07 | Зайда
Re: VERSION 1.4.
S@nya пише: > Dear Sirs and Madams, > Взагалі кажучи, "Sirs and Madams" уважають псевдокорректною формою. Заміна "Sirs/Madams" так само неприйнятна. Найкраще, на мене, відшукати на сайті організації-адресата ім'я її ґенсека чи іншого провідника і звертатися до ньогою > We would like to inform you that your Ukrainian partner, the Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications /USCRFST/, is involved in brutal and illegal actions against free mass-media in Ukraine. На мене, в контексті було б зрозуміло "free media" > On March 3, 2004, USCRFST broke the law and shut down Radio Kontynent. This was the only radio station rebroadcasting the programs of Radio Liberty/Radio Free Europe (RL/RFE), VOA, and other international broadcasters. > USCRFST is not authorized to take such actions; furthermore, the issue of canceling the license of Radio Kontynent is currently under consideration in the European Court of Human Rights, and thus any actions against this media outlet are illegal until the decision of European Court is announced. The only reason for shutting down Radio Kontynent is its free and independent broadcasting policy conflicting with President Kuchma’s campaign against independent media. Ліценезію частіше, здається, revoke. Формально, розгляд скарги в Страсбурзі не зупиняє виконання, тому "illegal until" є оцінним судженням, аніж констатацією фактів, хоча ЄСПЛ інколи може висловити прохання утриматись од дій, спрямованих на виконання вироку чи постанови суду. Можна також "announce" замінити на "pronounce". Можливо, "free and independent broadcasting policy" було б доречно скоротити до "independent broadcasting policy", бо "free2004.03.09 | Сивуляк Назар, адвокат
Re: VERSION 1.4.
підтримую2004.03.09 | Dmytro Kondratenko
Re: VERSION 1.4.
I am against the governments company to destroy free press!2004.03.08 | xabap
Цей лист написаний випускником канадського ВУЗ-у який не знає ук
Dear Audience,We would like to inform you that the Ukrainian State Centre of Radio Frequencies and Supervision for Telecommunications has been accused of questionably illegal actions against a freedom of speech mass media station in a manner involving governmental force.
On March the 3rd 2004 AD agent members on behalf of the USCRFST had radio station “Kontynent” closed with its known broadcasting equipment confiscated. The shutdown of radio station "Kontynent” has left Ukrainian language speakers without access to such European stations as Radio Liberty, Radio Free Europe, VOA and other international broadcasters.
The President of the Ukraine, Mister Kuchma has had conflicting problems with freedom of speech and the day-to-day realities of the people. The European Court has declared its desire to study the case and has issued orders that in the meantime further acts against freedom of speech mass media movements be disallowed in the Ukraine. Apparently the court sights that President Kuchma give reasons as to why the USCRFST be allowed continued discretion on blocking European transmissions that some consider to be sensitive and of good judgement.
The USCRFST and its actions on behalf of lead Ukrainian decision makers has been frowned and sharply frowned upon by some. The European Union and the United States has let it be known that they along with the European Court seek a better balance of Justice for the Ukrainian peoples in these matters.
The government of the Ukraine is presumable preparing to argue their side of the case further in response to these allegations of illegal activities.
2004.03.08 | xabap
Re: Цей лист написаний випускником канадського ВУЗ-у який не знає ук
До всіх хто читатиме.Я зрозумів ,що справа дуже поважна тому попросив знайомого,щоб редагував це письмо.Я переконаний,що це письмо написано правильно і в ньому ,,заховані,,всі вимоги тзв.етикети.Якщо моя і мойого знайомого поміч буде придатною-будем тому раді.З повагою ХАБАР.
2004.03.08 | xabap
Re: A graduate from THE Canada? Duh! Get rid of THE article
Знайте,Мертві бджоли...так по правді Ваша заувага фунта клаків не варта,всеж таки авторитети на які Ви покликайтесь якраз відповідають Вашим знанням і в тому вся проблема.Я пояснив чому просив людину написати.Він професийно займаєтся редагуванням листів поміж підприємствами,тому і просив його.А Ви можете написати як Вам подобаєтся.Щоб не тягнути бездумної розмови,хочу лиш побажати шанувальникам української і чужих мов як найменше вчителів таких як Ви.2004.03.08 | SeaL
Very well written apart from
a few minor things that have already been noted; probably a little too PC to suit the purpose... gotta nail down those SOBsThat said, I would stick with the latest version of the original letter.
There was a good comment elsewhere in the thread re. "revoking" vs. "canceling" the license; may want to use that correction.
Cheers:)
2004.03.08 | S@nya
Re: Thanks, but it seems to be a little bit too official... (-)
2004.03.08 | Зайда
Re: Цей лист написаний випускником канадського ВУЗ-у?!
>Dear Audience,А чому не 'To whom it may concern'?
>has been accused of questionably illegal actions against
>a freedom of speech mass media station in a manner involving governmental force.
А чому не 'has allegedly taken illegal actions?
А що це за абракадабра - 'a freedom of speech mass media station'?
А що це за 'manner involving governmental force'?
>On March the 3rd 2004 AD agent members on behalf of the USCRFST had >radio station “Kontynent” closed with its known broadcasting >equipment confiscated.
Де це в сучасній кореспонденції правничого кшталту вживають 'AD'?
Комами рік (2004) відділяти освічені канадійці вже перестали?
Хто це такі - 'agent members'?
'confiscated' - без рішення суду - нонсенс. 'Seized', звичайно ж, вірніше, хоч би що про це казав наш канадійський авторитет.
Станцію формально ніхто не 'closed'.
>such European stations as Radio Liberty, Radio Free Europe, VOA
Остання не належить до європейських станцій!
>The President of the Ukraine, Mister Kuchma
Тільки не намагайтесь переконати, що це втнув справжній фахівець!
>The European Court has declared its desire to study the case
У практиці Суду не існує формули такого штибу. Суд, можливо, визнав за прийнятну скаргу, спрямовану до нього п. Шолохом, але та скарга стосується не до нещодавніх дій Укрчастотнагляду.
>and has issued orders that in the meantime further acts against >freedom of speech mass media movements be disallowed in the Ukraine.
Це наслідок необізнаності з регламентом і повноваженнями Европейського Суду. Жодних orders він видавати не може.
>Apparently the court sights that President Kuchma give reasons as to >why the USCRFST be allowed continued discretion on blocking European >transmissions that some consider to be >sensitive and of good >judgement.
Ще один прояв невігластва: немає жодних причин вважати, ніби Суд може розраховувати на пояснення від Чучми.
>has been frowned and sharply frowned upon by some.
Публіцистичний зворот, який, на мене, випадає зі стилістичної тональності допису. Не кажучи вже про те, що 'sharply frowned' звучить дуже кумедно.
>The European Union and the United States has let it be known that
Граматика (has) в пана канадійського фахівця шкутильга на обидві.
'let it be known that', мабуть, викраяли з якогось королівського едикту ('May all men know by these presents'...)
>they along with the European Court
На мене, це таки різні суб'єкти... Не згадую вже про коми...
>for the Ukrainian peoples
Slip of the pen or...?
>The government <...> is presumable preparing
Ще одна новація в синтаксисі англійської?
Словом, чоловіче, не треба нас дурити зі своїми знайомими literati, хоча, звичайно, поміч - справа свята.